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Tigertatt

Active Vacuum Leaks

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I'm a BK who has recently switched to an active or elevated vacuum system and I completly love the system when I can keep the outer sleeve from leaking. My question is for other BK's that are using an active vac system.

What liners and sleeves are you using (name brands and model please) to keep a good vacuum seal and how do you prevent your socket from eating holes in your outer sleeve (if you use an outer sleeve).

Again this is dirrected at BK's mostly because the bending of the knee and the sharp edge of the socket at that point are what create the problem. :smile:

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Hey Tigertatt, ask your prothetic man for gator skin. Or you can use duct tape over all the sharp areas. That will help prevent it from teaaring or getting leaks. Jerry

My Prosthetic man isn't very up to date on products, he makes a hell of a socket but unless i give him spacific names and or numbers to order he's not real good at finding it. So Jerry, do you know who makes said product? or can you give me a link to their site?

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Hi Tigertatt, I talked to dennis at maryland prosthetic and he told me that you can order the Gators from otto bock. I checked there site and didn't see anything about them there, But you never know. Maybe your leg man can find them... I hope this helps???? Jerry

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Hi Tigertatt, I talked to dennis at maryland prosthetic and he told me that you can order the Gators from otto bock. I checked there site and didn't see anything about them there, But you never know. Maybe your leg man can find them... I hope this helps???? Jerry

Thank you sir -- that should be enough info to get him on the right track.

I'd still like to hear from others on what set ups they have used and like. I'm currently using an Alps PSI liner and the Ohio Williow Wood Alpha Flex Sleeve but i've also heard people like the Otto Bock Sleeve and some like the Ossur seal in liner with no outer sleeve.

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Hi Again Tigertatt, There is also something else that may work for you. It's 3M Microfoam tape. It comes in 1" or 2" wide. you should be able to pick it up in a hospital or order it. I have a roll that I keep on hand just in case. By the way I have an alps outer sleeve and it's a good one, But the otto bock liners keep tearing on me. sure would like to find something that would last longer. Jerry

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I'm a BK who has recently switched to an active or elevated vacuum system and I completly love the system when I can keep the outer sleeve from leaking. My question is for other BK's that are using an active vac system.

What liners and sleeves are you using (name brands and model please) to keep a good vacuum seal and how do you prevent your socket from eating holes in your outer sleeve (if you use an outer sleeve).

Again this is dirrected at BK's mostly because the bending of the knee and the sharp edge of the socket at that point are what create the problem. :smile:

Remove any sharp edges, if material/carbon is to thin a gator (thin protective sleeve) or protector (Otto-bock, Euro Int'l.) I have seen some good results with the Euro Int'l sleeve (one is dark grey, more heavy duty), Alps and Ottobock (new flex one). Also if you get in a jam and need to temporarily restore a seal you can use saren/plastic wrap- go around your knee at hole area. If you are kneeling use an old sleeve and/or pad the kneeling area. I have also padded the top of the socket with 1/8 spenco. You can expect 2-5 months out of a sleeve, not to say I haven't seen longer or shall I say smelled longer. So keep em clean so you can keep clean :rolleyes: Oh and you can move the sleeve, perodically up and down, different placement. Hope this helps, Mark

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I'm a BK who has recently switched to an active or elevated vacuum system and I completly love the system when I can keep the outer sleeve from leaking. My question is for other BK's that are using an active vac system.

What liners and sleeves are you using (name brands and model please) to keep a good vacuum seal and how do you prevent your socket from eating holes in your outer sleeve (if you use an outer sleeve).

Again this is dirrected at BK's mostly because the bending of the knee and the sharp edge of the socket at that point are what create the problem. :smile:

Remove any sharp edges, if material/carbon is to thin a gator (thin protective sleeve) or protector (Otto-bock, Euro Int'l.) I have seen some good results with the Euro Int'l sleeve (one is dark grey, more heavy duty), Alps and Ottobock (new flex one). Also if you get in a jam and need to temporarily restore a seal you can use saren/plastic wrap- go around your knee at hole area. If you are kneeling use an old sleeve and/or pad the kneeling area. I have also padded the top of the socket with 1/8 spenco. You can expect 2-5 months out of a sleeve, not to say I haven't seen longer or shall I say smelled longer. So keep em clean so you can keep clean :rolleyes: Oh and you can move the sleeve, perodically up and down, different placement. Hope this helps, Mark

Mark thank you for the effort but not much help without more spacific info. Yes i can "fix" all my problems with duct tape but I'm looking for some spacific combos (make and model or web link) that are currently working for BK people using or have use an elevated vac system, Money is not an issue i'd just like some names and models to pass along to my leg man so that we may find the best over all combo for my situation. I'm a k4 amputee and need to find a liner and, or sleeve combo that will hold up to my abuse. If there isn't something on the market currently then I know where to dirrect my next product patent efforts.

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My Prosthetic man isn't very up to date on products, he makes a hell of a socket but unless i give him spacific names and or numbers to order he's not real good at finding it. So Jerry, do you know who makes said product? or can you give me a link to their site?

Getting advice from fellow-amps is priceless....but so is having a CP who is up-to-date on latest trends.....surely :unsure:

Just voicing my thoughts....not trying to be argumentative or anthing.

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Sleeves are the weakest link in a vacuum system. I found the Alps Viva sleeve to be the most durable. It is also soft and flexible. I have, but don't use, a gator. It's just something else to tangle with.

If you're going to use the vacuum sytem, you might as well have a protective outer socket made. It's simple for your legman to do. He just makes another socket to go over your socket AND sleeve. It needs to come up high enough to shield the rim of the socket. It takes the abuse instead of the sleeve. It can be made out of plastic as it's only function is to protect the sleeve. Mine attaches to the regular socket with velcro patches.

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Sleeves are the weakest link in a vacuum system. I found the Alps Viva sleeve to be the most durable. It is also soft and flexible. I have, but don't use, a gator. It's just something else to tangle with.

If you're going to use the vacuum sytem, you might as well have a protective outer socket made. It's simple for your legman to do. He just makes another socket to go over your socket AND sleeve. It needs to come up high enough to shield the rim of the socket. It takes the abuse instead of the sleeve. It can be made out of plastic as it's only function is to protect the sleeve. Mine attaches to the regular socket with velcro patches.

THANK YOU !! Neal, exactly what i'm looking for :smile:. I've always used Alps liners and they have always held up well and I've been leaning towards trying their Sleeve but i've haven't come across anyone else that has used them. I just switch to the Limblogic VS so we went with the Alpha Flex Sleeve (recommended by Ohio Williow Wood) but the Alpha sleeve seems to have some issues still. The first one came apart in a week of low use (manufacture defect) and the second one was cut by a sharp spot on my socket (which we found and fixed but can't return the liner under warranty for that problem) I've liked the look of the Otto Bock sleeve with it's preformed 85 degree flex but wanted some other opinions before we ordered (and maybe destroyed) other sleeves to find one that works well.

Ally, My original CP took a job with a company that is making medical tools so he is no longer practicing so I got handed to the new guy they hired who is really a nice and down to earth fella but he worked 15 years at Shriner's so he's used to dealing with children and since children grow and change so fast things like vacuum systems rarely get used. He's willing to try new things and learn as he goes, so I figured I'd play guinea pig for him and if he can learn new and better things that help other people down the road then I don't mind being the one to practice on. :tongue:

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Sleeves are the weakest link in a vacuum system. I found the Alps Viva sleeve to be the most durable. It is also soft and flexible. I have, but don't use, a gator. It's just something else to tangle with.

If you're going to use the vacuum sytem, you might as well have a protective outer socket made. It's simple for your legman to do. He just makes another socket to go over your socket AND sleeve. It needs to come up high enough to shield the rim of the socket. It takes the abuse instead of the sleeve. It can be made out of plastic as it's only function is to protect the sleeve. Mine attaches to the regular socket with velcro patches.

:biggrin: This does work very well for those kneeling often.Some don't like the bulk or addition. I agree Alps is among the best. Make sure your prosthetist provides rounded edge/brim on your socket. There are sleeves that have an inner fabric reinforcement but found them restricting knee flexion (bend). You should be able to find Euro Int'l web site or it may be Ortho Europe, I think their the same, sorry for the confusion. If you still have trouble finding this I can provide exact item #'s and/or location. You can always go to O&P Edge for the latest to check out product. Take care, Mark :smile:

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Sleeves are the weakest link in a vacuum system. I found the Alps Viva sleeve to be the most durable. It is also soft and flexible. I have, but don't use, a gator. It's just something else to tangle with.

If you're going to use the vacuum sytem, you might as well have a protective outer socket made. It's simple for your legman to do. He just makes another socket to go over your socket AND sleeve. It needs to come up high enough to shield the rim of the socket. It takes the abuse instead of the sleeve. It can be made out of plastic as it's only function is to protect the sleeve. Mine attaches to the regular socket with velcro patches.

:biggrin: This does work very well for those kneeling often. Some don't like the bulk or addition. Make sure your prosthetist provides rounded edge/brim on your socket. There are sleeves that have an inner fabric reinforcement but found them restricting knee flexion (bend). You should be able to find Euro Int'l web site or it may be Ortho Europe, I think their the same, sorry for the confusion. If you still have trouble finding this I can provide exact item #'s and/or location. You can always go to O&P Edge for the latest to check out product. Take care, Mark :smile:

I had a minute to check Euro International web site, the product is ContexGel Sleeve, the lighter model is there standard, they don't have the heavy duty one shown, the darker gray. Also Otto Bock finally has a better sleeve Derma ProFlex. Your prosthetist will need to measure you for size to ensure a correct fit. I hope this helps, Mark :tongue:

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Sleeves are the weakest link in a vacuum system. I found the Alps Viva sleeve to be the most durable. It is also soft and flexible. I have, but don't use, a gator. It's just something else to tangle with.

If you're going to use the vacuum sytem, you might as well have a protective outer socket made. It's simple for your legman to do. He just makes another socket to go over your socket AND sleeve. It needs to come up high enough to shield the rim of the socket. It takes the abuse instead of the sleeve. It can be made out of plastic as it's only function is to protect the sleeve. Mine attaches to the regular socket with velcro patches.

:biggrin: This does work very well for those kneeling often. Some don't like the bulk or addition. Make sure your prosthetist provides rounded edge/brim on your socket. There are sleeves that have an inner fabric reinforcement but found them restricting knee flexion (bend). You should be able to find Euro Int'l web site or it may be Ortho Europe, I think their the same, sorry for the confusion. If you still have trouble finding this I can provide exact item #'s and/or location. You can always go to O&P Edge for the latest to check out product. Take care, Mark :smile:

Mark, for your future info everything comes up under Ortho Europe now. Which seems to be just a generic supply house similar to SPI or Kingsley here in the USA. The liners they carry are all Ohio Willow Wood, Alpha line and the suspension sleeves all seem to be Silipos. I have extensive lists of products and manufactures but information from a manufacturers site is completely worthless because they all tell me their product is the best. This is why I ask for input from BK amputees who have used these products and who have gone through the trial and error process themselves. Anyone who hasn't personally used these products can only make generic, blanket statements that don't really help me pick out the products that work best for this situation.

companies that make liners and sleeves

1) Ohio Williow Wood -- http://www.owwco.com/ Sleeve -- http://www.owwco.com/pdf/catalog/B/FlexSleeve.pdf

2) Otto Bock -- http://www.ottobockus.com/ Sleeves -- http://www.ottobockus.com/cps/rde/xchg/ob_...s.xsl/1760.html Liners -- http://www.ottobockus.com/cps/rde/xchg/ob_...s.xsl/1749.html

3) Ossur -- http://www.ossur.com/ Sleeves -- http://www.ossur.com/prosthetics/locksandsleeves Liners -- http://www.ossur.com/prosthetics/liners

4) Alps -- http://www.easyliner.com/ Sleeves and Liners -- http://www.easyliner.com/Prosthetic.aspx

5) ESP -- http://www.wearesp.com/site/index.php Sleeves -- http://www.wearesp.com/site/knee.php Liners -- http://www.wearesp.com/site/liners.php

6) Evolution Liners -- http://www.evolutionliners.com/

7) Silipos -- http://www.silipos.com/home/home.aspx Sleeves -- http://www.silipos.com/002_prod/subcategor...at_name=Sleeves Liners -- http://www.silipos.com/002_prod/subcategor...cat_name=Liners

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Sleeves are the weakest link in a vacuum system. I found the Alps Viva sleeve to be the most durable. It is also soft and flexible. I have, but don't use, a gator. It's just something else to tangle with.

If you're going to use the vacuum sytem, you might as well have a protective outer socket made. It's simple for your legman to do. He just makes another socket to go over your socket AND sleeve. It needs to come up high enough to shield the rim of the socket. It takes the abuse instead of the sleeve. It can be made out of plastic as it's only function is to protect the sleeve. Mine attaches to the regular socket with velcro patches.

:biggrin: This does work very well for those kneeling often. Some don't like the bulk or addition. Make sure your prosthetist provides rounded edge/brim on your socket. There are sleeves that have an inner fabric reinforcement but found them restricting knee flexion (bend). You should be able to find Euro Int'l web site or it may be Ortho Europe, I think their the same, sorry for the confusion. If you still have trouble finding this I can provide exact item #'s and/or location. You can always go to O&P Edge for the latest to check out product. Take care, Mark :smile:

Mark, for your future info everything comes up under Ortho Europe now. Which seems to be just a generic supply house similar to SPI or Kingsley here in the USA. The liners they carry are all Ohio Willow Wood, Alpha line and the suspension sleeves all seem to be Silipos. I have extensive lists of products and manufactures but information from a manufacturers site is completely worthless because they all tell me their product is the best. This is why I ask for input from BK amputees who have used these products and who have gone through the trial and error process themselves. Anyone who hasn't personally used these products can only make generic, blanket statements that don't really help me pick out the products that work best for this situation.

companies that make liners and sleeves

1) Ohio Williow Wood -- http://www.owwco.com/ Sleeve -- http://www.owwco.com/pdf/catalog/B/FlexSleeve.pdf

2) Otto Bock -- http://www.ottobockus.com/ Sleeves -- http://www.ottobockus.com/cps/rde/xchg/ob_...s.xsl/1760.html Liners -- http://www.ottobockus.com/cps/rde/xchg/ob_...s.xsl/1749.html

3) Ossur -- http://www.ossur.com/ Sleeves -- http://www.ossur.com/prosthetics/locksandsleeves Liners -- http://www.ossur.com/prosthetics/liners

4) Alps -- http://www.easyliner.com/ Sleeves and Liners -- http://www.easyliner.com/Prosthetic.aspx

5) ESP -- http://www.wearesp.com/site/index.php Sleeves -- http://www.wearesp.com/site/knee.php Liners -- http://www.wearesp.com/site/liners.php

6) Evolution Liners -- http://www.evolutionliners.com/

7) Silipos -- http://www.silipos.com/home/home.aspx Sleeves -- http://www.silipos.com/002_prod/subcategor...at_name=Sleeves Liners -- http://www.silipos.com/002_prod/subcategor...cat_name=Liners

:glare: I guess you didn't notice my reply to Neal? :rolleyes: I had gone to the Euro International web site, I just goggled Euro International prosthetics. Yea I'm just an AK amputee, just trying to help but I should stay in the AK arena. Thanks for all the cool links. Hope you find what your lookin for- :biggrin:

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If you do get a leak, I have found that a wetsuit repair kit (found at diving stores) works wonders on sealing up any holes and prolonging the life of the sleeve.

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I used to be the poster Child for the Harmony system and while i liked it I would blow sleeves and pump seals so much that it was too costly. I now use ossuer seal in and get the same comfort as the harmony without the added expense of Sleeves. You can repair sleeves with a spot of super glue. I used to carry a tube and within a moment a hole was repaired and on I would cycle.

If you do get a leak, I have found that a wetsuit repair kit (found at diving stores) works wonders on sealing up any holes and prolonging the life of the sleeve.

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After all your good input I had my leg guy order an Otto Bock, Derma ProFlex liner http://www.ottobockus.com/cps/rde/xchg/ob_...s.xsl/1760.html and a gator. And i now have a bottle of super glue on me at all times :biggrin: Thank you too all who took the time to reply or PM me with your tips and info.

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After all your good input I had my leg guy order an Otto Bock, Derma ProFlex liner http://www.ottobockus.com/cps/rde/xchg/ob_...s.xsl/1760.html and a gator. And i now have a bottle of super glue on me at all times :biggrin: Thank you too all who took the time to reply or PM me with your tips and info.

The ProFlex sleeve is the best one I've had, I've been using the same one for about 8 or 9 months now, still works great, not any damage at all around the brim area. Plus, it gives a lot better bending the knee. I'm extremely happy with the ProFlex!! LOL, Ortho Bionic (that's printed on the box.) You can probably throw the glue away! Otto Bock did it right with this sleeve!!!

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After all your good input I had my leg guy order an Otto Bock, Derma ProFlex liner http://www.ottobockus.com/cps/rde/xchg/ob_...s.xsl/1760.html and a gator. And i now have a bottle of super glue on me at all times :biggrin: Thank you too all who took the time to reply or PM me with your tips and info.

The ProFlex sleeve is the best one I've had, I've been using the same one for about 8 or 9 months now, still works great, not any damage at all around the brim area. Plus, it gives a lot better bending the knee. I'm extremely happy with the ProFlex!! LOL, Ortho Bionic (that's printed on the box.) You can probably throw the glue away! Otto Bock did it right with this sleeve!!!

I wish I could edit to add this, but oh well. I wanted to add that I am very active, and hard on sleeves, so to be holding up this long is fantastic! I also find it works well in bike riding. Before, with the Harmony sleeve, I'd always have an issue with the sleeve slipping down with all the knee bendng, this one stays in place. Seems to also help with the issue of sweating heavily inside the liner as well.

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After 2 weeks of use the Otto Bock ProFlex sleeve and gator are still going strong. Tom is soooo right, right out of the box I could tell the Sleeve was MUCH better built than the couple I had previously tried. The ProFLex is thinner and does bend much better than the others and the outer fabric is very tough but also shear at the same time. After trying the Ohio Willow Wood, Alpha Flex Sleeve (i went though 3 of these sleeves in the first 2 weeks, 1 was factory defect, one my socket cut but the way the sleeve is made you can't fix it in the area it was cut, and the third was the replacement for the defective one and it never sealed right, can't find a cut or hole anywhere in it but it won't seal.) and an Alps sleeve (the alps sleeve worked ok but I managed to get a couple small holes and cuts in it in a day or two) the Otto Bock, ProFlex sleeve is the only sleeve I'll use now. I'm going to have my leg guy order a couple more :biggrin:

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